Navigating the Dynamics of PEX Fittings Industry: Material Competition, Market Trends, and Collaboration Prospects

Discussion on PEX Fittings

 

Dear team,

I am Ishan from ChemBizR – a research and consulting firm. We partner with global companies to improve their strategy and optimize their operations- supply chain, material development, etc.

 

I gave your team a call the other day, and am writing to affirm representation from my company. We are interested in having a discussion with you on PEX fittings and materials used for them.

 

Let us know if you have any preferences for setting up a call. Thanks!

 

Best Regards,

 

Ishan Gupta

Associate Consultant- Specialty Polymers and Materials

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Dear Mr. Ishan Gupta

Good day to you and tks for your call.

Attached  fittings price list for US market for your reference, please check it out and let me know if you want

more information.

Awaiting your feedback.

Best Regards

Eric

YUHUAN YD VALVE CO., LTD

Add No.18 Qinghua North Road, Qinggang Town,

Yuhuan, Zhejiang, P.R.China

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Dear Eric,

 

Thank you for sharing the documents. I have a few questions about your company:

 

  1. What PPSU supplier material do you use and which grades?
  2. Can you share what suppliers you have existing relationships with, so we can have choice if we go towards a long-term manufacturing contract?
  3. What is your take on mPPSU (Acudel or Paryls) grade fittings? Do you manufacture those and if so, can you provide credible reference customers? (as there are already US companies who use mPPSU fittings manufactured from China we know of)

 

That’s all from my side now. Do let me know if anything is unclear. Just for your reference as we already mentioned, we are looking for a manufacturer to build a long-term contract with rather than placing one time orders.

 

Just a heads up, you can expect more meetings and questions coming ahead to know more about your company and then see if we can give you a visit to talk about making a contract.

 

Ishan Gupta

Associate Consultant- Specialty Polymers and Materials

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Dear Mr.Ishan Gupta,

Good day to you.

Generally, We use Solvay ppsu material,and for regular size(less than 1 inch,including 1 inch),we use Acudel,for large size and manifold we use Radel. Otherwise,there’s fracture risk if we use Acudel into the large size. We have the experience and the QC to control it.

TBH, we know the mPPSU, 95% PPSU fittings are made with SLOVAY’s material, 5% are from mPPSU.  It all depend on customer.

We know mPPSU, and know not a few fty start to use mPPSU in fittings, but most of customers will still use SOLVAY material in our company, because this industry is traditional, plumbing need stable and 100% security, and after plumber install the pex pipe behind the wall, it need 5-10 years to observe the leaking rate, but the mPPSU enter this markert only 2-3 years.  It need time to prove or test it. Few people like risk in this industry.

On the one hand, our most large customers, like Sharkbite, NIBCO, BMI, Sioux Cheif still would like to choose SOLVAY.

On the other hand, nowadays the price of SOLVAY is also competitive compared with UJU. It’s even the same or only 5-10% GAP.

So, we still choose to recommend PPSU from SOLVAY, of course, I’m happy to find more and more Chinese material supplier has the ability to produce PPSU material. This market become more and more competitive, SOLVAY is a very strong and professional material supplier in PPSU, like a teacher, and Chinese supplier like UJU, is also very motivated and competitive, like a hardworking student.

It seems like the relationship between US and China, it’s interesting, competitive relationship.

By the way, in our mass production, our worker or injection enginner prefer the SOLVAY material? Do you know why? Because UJU mppsu will corrode the mould, PPSU from SOLVAY won’t.

If any quesiton, keep posted.

YUHUAN YD VALVE CO., LTD

Add No.18 Qinghua North Road, Qinggang Town,

Yuhuan, Zhejiang, P.R.China

Email: info@ydvalves.com

Website:www.ydvalves.com

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Dear Eric,

 

Pleasure hearing back from you,

 

Just to clarify a few points,

  • Acudel is also mPPSU – just from Solvay instead of Youju. So when you say mPPSU 5 % – does it mean Acudel is also used less, or Uju mPPSU is used 5%(less) compared to Radel and Acudel?
  • From our observation we have seen that mPPSU is being used only in the US market. Is it also being used in Europe? Can you give the names of some companies which are using them? We know Rehau uses it in the US.
  • Talking about the price, I think the prices came down recently that’s why the difference is not much right? Because there was a time back when the price difference was almost 30-40% or even more, and Solvay had a supply issue, correct?
  • Yes, it will be interesting to see how UJU can improve quality, our partner is also very interested in that.
  • Just curious to ask, is any Ultrason P certified for use from BASF? It does not seem to dominate in the market.

 

So far, I feel great about your knowledge and experience. Also, you seem to have a good customer base, I will forward details and will keep you posted on any questions that keep coming through.

 

A few more things: From your experience, can you tell me more about the scenario of PEX-a or PEX-b piping, which is preferred in different areas? Because, as per my understanding, unless the pipe is Zurn or Sioux plastic fitting will have a disadvantage in flow resistance, and PEX-b is most used. Our partner is a relatively new entrant in this market and hence is also interested to know your opinion on this. This will affect brass fitting replacement and total opportunity.

 

Also, I am interested to know, do you work only in US and EU. Can you share your status in other countries of Asia, if you have any customers or how much quantity do you supply?

 

Thank you for the detailed responses, just to update your position looks good so far, if everything goes well our partner will plan a visit to your factory soon.

 

Best Regards,

 

Ishan Gupta

Associate Consultant- Specialty Polymers and Materials

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Dear Mr. Ishan Gupta

Tks for your reply.

I hope this email finds you well. Thank you for reaching out to us and for your interest in our products and services. Before we proceed further with addressing your queries, I would like to ensure that we fully understand the purpose and expectations of our current communication.

Could you please clarify the main objectives you have in mind for this interaction? It would be immensely helpful for us to gain a deeper understanding of your needs and concerns, allowing us to provide you with more accurate and tailored responses.

If there are any specific goals or requirements you have in mind, please don’t hesitate to let us know. We are committed to assisting you in any way we can.

Looking forward to your response. Thank you once again for choosing to engage with us.

Best regards,

Eric

YUHUAN YD VALVE CO., LTD

Add No.18 Qinghua North Road, Qinggang Town,

Yuhuan, Zhejiang, P.R.China

Email: info@ydvalves.com

Website:www.ydvalves.com

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Dear Eric,

 

Sure, As I might have mentioned previously, we are working with a partner who is looking for a manufacturer to engage in a long-term supply contract. We as consultants, are helping them find and evaluate suppliers that can ensure supply security, technical assistance, manufacturing capabilities, and expertise. Based on this, if we find the company profile satisfactory, we then proceed with the next stage of in-detailed assessment, which will include a factory visit, credit evaluation, and some other due formalities. After that, we can proceed with contract terms and negotiations.

 

Currently, this is an early-stage discussion that we are planning to verify and assess thoroughly, after that we will submit feedback and then wait for the approvals to move on to the next stage.

 

This is all the details for now, feel free to ask for any clarifications.Hey Mr.Ishan Gupta,

Just to clarify a few points,

Eric: I’m glad to receive your professional question, let me reply one by one in below in blue.

Acudel is also mPPSU – just from Solvay instead of Youju. So when you say mPPSU 5 % – does it mean Acudel is also used less, or Uju mPPSU is used 5%(less) compared to Radel and Acudel?

Eric:  Sir, I got your idea, yes, I knew it, you’re correct the letter “m” before PPSU it means mixed, because Acudel are made from 70%PPSU and 30%PSU.

And Radel is pure PPSU, it has the better quality compared Acudel, of course the price is higher.

But I need to tell you, mPPSU from Youju is only 50% PPSU+50%PSU, that’s the point, of course a few importer and Chinese manufacture will still choose UJU, because importer like the cheap fittings, the reason why these Chinese manufacture choose UJU because SOLVAY won’t offer their material.

SOLVAY only offer to material to their long term partner. So, these fty has to choose UJU.

And what I said in last mail, is our 95% PPSU material is from SOLVAY, and 5% material is from my other customer who insist to use UJU, I’don’t care what material they finally choose as long as they allow it.

And I will tell you another truth, for the large size, 1inch, 2inch, only the Radel from SOLVAY is secure , no risk, otherwise, it will leak and fracture. Even we use Acudel from SOLVAY, it failed after thousand of times test.

It’s really amazing, right? We have the experience. Our attitude to SOLVAY is support, but to UJU, our is neutrality, we don’t agree and don’t support.

Because it need time to prove if the mppsu from UJU is secure, but they’re a great company.

From our observation we have seen that mPPSU is being used only in the US market. Is it also being used in Europe? Can you give the names of some companies which are using them? We know Rehau uses it in the US.

Talking about the price, I think the prices came down recently that’s why the difference is not much right? Because there was a time back when the price difference was almost 30-40% or even more, and Solvay had a supply issue, correct?

Yes, it will be interesting to see how UJU can improve quality, our partner is also very interested in that.

Just curious to ask, is any Ultrason P certified for use from BASF? It does not seem to dominate in the market.

Eric:  Yes, absolutely right, mPPSU is very widely used in US, and in Europe, sorry we don’t have many customers, but SOLVAY told me Europe use more Redual, because the European is more traditional, it’s invented in European, and brought to US, and American like cheaper fittings, so mPPSU is made especially for US market.  But in our fty, we use pure PPSU for large size, I have told you before.

You’re 100% right about price, this year, PPSU from SOLVAY start to decline, to compete with UJU, Jingfa, Haoran, Chinese material supplier. HAHA. It seems Chinese fty do well in competition. It make SOLVAY has to change.

In 2022, because the demand of pex fittings crazy increase, so SOLVAY lack of PSU, they even replace my mPPSU with PPSU, LOL, price no change.

But from 2023, the supply issue has been sloved, it won’t happen.

For BASF, as I know, their main PPSU market is in feeder for baby and others, not in plumbing, and I heard from one guy their Germany factory has been closed because the energy cost too high.

Whatever, BASF’s PPSU is not much in this plumbing market.  Solvay is the boss.

So far, I feel great about your knowledge and experience. Also, you seem to have a good customer base, I will forward details and will keep you posted on any questions that keep coming through.

Eric: thank you very much for your comment. Keep posted, I’m also very happy to talk with you about so detailed information, I could say you’re also suuuuuper professional in my all customers.

Talking with you also could help me bulid my knowledge. It’s improtant.

Most guys only concern about price or lead time, but you focus on product and material itself.

 

A few more things: From your experience, can you tell me more about the scenario of PEX-a or PEX-b piping, which is preferred in different areas? Because, as per my understanding, unless the pipe is Zurn or Sioux plastic fitting will have a disadvantage in flow resistance, and PEX-b is most used. Our partner is a relatively new entrant in this market and hence is also interested to know your opinion on this. This will affect brass fitting replacement and total opportunity.

Eric: I’m not very clear about “unless the pipe is Zurn or Sioux plastic fitting will have a disadvantage in flow resistance, and PEX-b is most used“. Sorry.

If I don’t consider the price, of course I will choose PEX-A, the pipe could be bend a lot, and the installation is easier, it should resist the low temperature better, and bigger flow.

But it has disadvantage, the price is much higer than PEX-B, both pipe and fittings. And it need more expensive tooling.

But I have to say, more and more plumber change PEX-B into PEX-A.  Because it really could save time and labor.

Also, I am interested to know, do you work only in US and EU. Can you share your status in other countries of Asia, if you have any customers or how much quantity do you supply?

Eric: yes, our business only in US and EU, let me share some experience, in South America, PEX no business, they use PPR, and in Asia, almost household use PPR, there’s no business for pex in Asia.

Oh, Russia use Rehau fittings almost. They use brass pex fittings much more than PPSU, some guys has put ppsu rehau fittings into market, but not sold as well as in US. We just returened from Russia in last month.

 

Thank you for the detailed responses, just to update your position looks good so far, if everything goes well our partner will plan a visit to your factory soon.

Welcome you visit us and eat seafood, keep posted,

YUHUAN YD VALVE CO., LTD

Add No.18 Qinghua North Road, Qinggang Town,

Yuhuan, Zhejiang, P.R.China

Email: info@ydvalves.com

Website:www.ydvalves.com

 

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Dear Eric,

Thank you for the detailed response. It has been a real pleasure communicating with you, many people I have spoken to don’t have the knowledge and proper communication like yours. Just sharing my views and clarifying some thoughts on your response:

 

I’m not very clear about “unless the pipe is Zurn or Sioux plastic fitting will have a disadvantage in flow resistance, and PEX-b is most used“. Sorry.

To clarify, PEX-b pipes are less flexible, hence cold expansion fittings cannot be used (as they cannot be expanded and wrapped around the flexible PEX-a pipe), so the fittings have to be insert/crimp fittings. And for that, the ASTM specifications in the US and EU require thicker plastic fittings as compared to brass. Hence, the thicker the fitting, the lower the inner diameter, which leads to pressure loss if there are many fittings in the system. But Zurn and Sioux, have made their PEX-b pipes flexible and certified to be used with cold expansion fittings, so there also plastic now should have even more advantages than Brass. I think you already knew the previous part, the Zurn and Sioux one might be unknown. I do not know much though, feel free to correct me anywhere. In any case, happy to share and clarify.

 

SOLVAY only offers to material to their long-term partner. So, these fly has to choose UJU.

Yes, this might be true. I heard from one of my contacts that Solvay had a supply issue and has stopped providing Acudel in Asia. Is that true, or was that temporary as you mentioned?

 

Talking with you also could help me bulid my knowledge. It’s improtant.

Most guys only concern about price or lead time, but you focus on product and material itself.

Sure, it is what we do. We feel building a good connection, and trust and having a proper understanding of each other businesses is what helps us build good and valuable business relationships. The exchange of ideas and knowledge within the industry always helps and benefits everyone.

 

Thank you for the updates and for writing everything in such detail, I am impressed. Also, the thing you said about BASF shutting down its plant in Germany due to high energy costs. If it’s not a problem for you, can you ask your contact and share some more details? It’s surprising to me as I have seen their business closely and is of high interest to me personally. No pressure, but it would be great if you could share some more details or at least confirm if that’s the condition now.

 

And of course, I will share my feedback with our partners, and let you know if they have any further questions or if we can move ahead with the next steps. Thank you for your time!

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Dear Eric,

I hope you are doing great!

 

There is one question we got from our partner that I would like to share with you. One of the members in the meeting was asking about PP-R and CPVC insert fittings. Can they also be made from Acudel/Radel? Can you please share your experience on this and if you also manufacture those insert fittings for China/India/South America market?

 

Looking forward to hearing from you.

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Thank you for the detailed response. It has been a real pleasure communicating with you, many people I have spoken to don’t have the knowledge and proper communication like yours. Just sharing my views and clarifying some thoughts on your response:

 

I’m not very clear about “unless the pipe is Zurn or Sioux plastic fitting will have a disadvantage in flow resistance, and PEX-b is most used“. Sorry.

To clarify, PEX-b pipes are less flexible, hence cold expansion fittings cannot be used (as they cannot be expanded and wrapped around the flexible PEX-a pipe), so the fittings have to be insert/crimp fittings. And for that, the ASTM specifications in the US and EU require thicker plastic fittings as compared to brass. Hence, the thicker the fitting, the lower the inner diameter, which leads to pressure loss if there are many fittings in the system. But Zurn and Sioux, have made their PEX-b pipes flexible and certified to be used with cold expansion fittings, so there also plastic now should have even more advantages than Brass. I think you already knew the previous part, the Zurn and Sioux one might be unknown. I do not know much though, feel free to correct me anywhere. In any case, happy to share and clarify.

Sorry to send you late, I’m prepareing to visit Thailand for business these days, thus miss to reply you.

Yes, your all above is corret. Zurn has the PEX-B product lines and improve it to connect the f1960 fittings, yours is all right, but I feel the logic is not very smooth, let me smooth it, shall I?

We all know the pex-A has a bigger flow than pex-B, and in this market, F1960 PPSU qty is more than F1960 bass, do you know why?

The real reason is the cost, because F1960 fittings is large, the weight and material really affect the price, so Uponor recommend their PPSU F1960 fitting more. There’s only one reason why any product sold well,  it’s cheap. At least, the price is very improtant factor.

Their gap will be 50-100%. even some 150-200%.

For pex crimp fittings, the gap between 2159 and 1807 will be less than F1960. only 20-50%.

I don’t know why Zurn recommend the plumber use their improve PEX-B to replace the PEX-A pipe, why they didn’t directly produce PEX-A pipe, the cost? The capacity?  Or the technolgy?  Do you know the reason?

I heard from some plumber that they complain Zurn’s pex B pipe will be break in installtion in LOW temperure.

SOLVAY only offers to material to their long-term partner. So, these fly has to choose UJU.

Yes, this might be true. I heard from one of my contacts that Solvay had a supply issue and has stopped providing Acudel in Asia. Is that true, or was that temporary as you mentioned?

Whatever, SOLVAY told us they have sloved this supply issue, and personally, even though SOLVAY has the supply issue, their capacity is much larger than chinese material supplier.

And you should know Uponor refuse Chinese material supplier, they only work with SOLVAY. That’s also the reason why we support or choose SOLVAY. In this POLY/PPSU industry, Uponor is specilist, teacher, boss, and leader.

They invent this connection, and so, we have today our business, of course, our vision is to invent a connection from us. LOL. This industry is really amaziing, like RWC invent Sharkbite, like Viega invent press.

Like Mr Solvay build SOLVAY company, great person, and great company.

 

Talking with you also could help me bulid my knowledge. It’s improtant.

Most guys only concern about price or lead time, but you focus on product and material itself.

Sure, it is what we do. We feel building a good connection, and trust and having a proper understanding of each other businesses is what helps us build good and valuable business relationships. The exchange of ideas and knowledge within the industry always helps and benefits everyone.

I agree.

 

Thank you for the updates and for writing everything in such detail, I am impressed. Also, the thing you said about BASF shutting down its plant in Germany due to high energy costs. If it’s not a problem for you, can you ask your contact and share some more details? It’s surprising to me as I have seen their business closely and is of high interest to me personally. No pressure, but it would be great if you could share some more details or at least confirm if that’s the condition now.

Sorry, I’m afraid that it’s all I know, and BASF don’t have much business in plumbing, so we knew few.  I could tell you much about SOLVAY, but few about BASF.

Let’s return our business, may I ask if you have purchase plan about PPSU fittings? I’d like to share you our good price about PPSU fittings. LOL.

I think, future belong to PPSU fittings, you know Uponor F1960 fittings really are sold well in US, our price will be much more competitive than theirs.

YUHUAN YD VALVE CO., LTD

Add No.18 Qinghua North Road, Qinggang Town,

Yuhuan, Zhejiang, P.R.China

Email: info@ydvalves.com

Website:www.ydvalves.com

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Dear Mr.Ishan Gupta,

Good day

Of course not,ppr and cpvc has into own connection methoud,ppr use hot melting,and cpvc use chemical connection. it can’t be made in PPSU,sorry,we only focus on global pex or copper pipe marekt,ppr or cpvx is not our professional industry. As I know,few household will use ppr in US,right?

Best Regards,

Eric

YUHUAN YD VALVE CO., LTD

Add No.18 Qinghua North Road, Qinggang Town,

Yuhuan, Zhejiang, P.R.China

Email: info@ydvalves.com

Website:www.ydvalves.com

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Dear Eric,

 

Thank you for the response.

 

Firstly, we have forwarded your details to our partner, this a long-deadline project, so it might take a few more weeks for us to get back to you regarding moving ahead with quotations/contracts and other due formalities.

 

Regarding the PPR, I received a document from Solvay promoting its materials for CPVC and PPR pipe fittings. Yes, they use PPR in the US too. I was also surprised at how these fittings could be used for CPVC/PPR. They are insert fittings. I am attaching the document, maybe you can go through it once and share your thoughts if any.

 

Thanks!

 

Best Regards,

 

Ishan Gupta

Associate Consultant- Specialty Polymers and Materials

 


 

Title: In-Depth Analysis: Development and Collaboration in the PEX Fittings Industry

Chapter 1: Material Competition and Market Trends

PEX fittings are crucial materials in the construction and plumbing sectors, and their selection is closely tied to market trends. Through the email correspondence between Ishan Gupta and YD Valve Co., Ltd, we can observe key discussions regarding material selection. Ishan initially expressed interest in PEX fittings and materials, inquiring about PPSU suppliers, mPPSU materials, and price competitiveness, reflecting industry concerns about material performance, supply chain stability, and price competition.

Eric Shao’s response detailed the specific aspects of the materials used, market trends, and the company’s reasons for choosing different materials. He emphasized the advantages of Solvay materials and the importance of long-term collaboration. This demonstrates the factors suppliers consider when choosing materials, such as technical advantages and collaborative relationships.

Chapter 2: Market Competition and Product Advantages

In the email exchanges, both parties discussed the competitive advantages of different materials. For instance, Eric provided a comparison between PEX-a and PEX-b pipe types, along with observations and experiences in different regional markets. He also shared YD Valve’s business status and customer situations in different regions, indicating the intensity of market competition and the performance of different materials in regional markets.

The emails also touched upon discussions about PP-R and CPVC insert fittings. Eric explained the company’s expertise and product range, emphasizing their primary focus on the global PEX and copper pipe markets. This underscores the need for suppliers to clarify their product advantages and professionalism in the competitive market to better serve customers and expand market share.

Chapter 3: Collaboration Opportunities and Long-term Partnerships

In addition to product materials and market competition, the email exchanges also covered collaboration opportunities and the importance of long-term partnerships. Ishan expressed anticipation for collaboration prospects and discussed follow-up steps and collaboration plans. This highlights the significance of professionalism, trust, and shared development goals among partners in a fiercely competitive market environment.

Chapter 4: Technological Innovation and Global Markets

Lastly, the email exchanges touched on topics of technological innovation and global markets. With continuous technological advancements and evolving market demands, suppliers need to drive innovation to enhance product performance, reduce costs, and explore opportunities in global markets. This reflects the industry’s need to maintain keen insights and innovative capabilities when facing new challenges and opportunities.

In conclusion, through a deep analysis of email exchanges, we can see the development and challenges in the PEX fittings industry regarding material selection, market competition, collaboration opportunities, and technological innovation. These aspects collectively shape the development landscape of the PEX fittings industry and provide essential insights for its future directions.

Related Products:

F1960 PPSU Expansion Fittings

 

 

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